Leaderboard

Mostly together now,need to put drive chain on and make a few adjustments. This is what it looks like.

Thanks for the heads up @Player @KonixI wrote the software for Inquizitor and some of the other games as well as developing the various versions of viper/cobra/cyclone hardware. I have a Viper board which I think works. Also an Inquizitor disk but it seems to be unreadable. A don’t know if it can be cleaned up or if there’s anything which can be done ? All of the Viper/Cobra games which we have software for are emulated in MAME. I might have schematics and a manual for the Flare chipset somewhere. Feel free to ask whatever, I’ll help if I can.

Here is a quick vid.the missus can't get past first hole. 20241229_211930.mp4

Here it is done,now for the final touches.so I've got to strip it all now.

I am the chap who bought this, I paid significantly less than the £150 advertised price, I partly went to get this machine as it was only 15 minutes away. The issue was the cog that sits on the variator was missing, I had to replace the whole variator unit. I have played this game for around 6 hours now and I can say it is not my favourite. I have had 1 token win in this entire time and I am illogically trying to force token wins with the holds I choose, on the flip side I have had the 20p win repeat at least 8 times. The meters also show through its lifetime it is sitting just above 81% RTP which is a fair game. I almost certainly will offer this machine back out to the community at some point. Now I have managed to sort the issue out and can use Mecca I am excited to read all of the forum, My aim is by the end of this year to be able to perform a full service on a electro to a good standard.

I don’t see any negatives at all with redrose bowl, the owner is a collector and enthusiast that goes back decades,you won’t be seeing Hollywood bowl getting line ups etc etc to amuse yourself while the rest of your family kids /grandkids are bowling id happily go and lose £30 on a weekly basis if I lived up that way…

Why don't you come and see the machines rather than slagging everything I have said on this topic if not keep it shut

They are holding up very well thanks being switched on 14 hours a day. There is now in full working order Line Up Frog Hop Adders and Ladders High Lights Exchange Unlimited Fire Cracker All working fine on new coins and getting reasonably used. Cash or Nudge not in the line yet but is fully working with a slight lamp fault Not about making money just good to see them for play and many people love them just for the memories they brought to them when they were younger

A quick write up of a few Ace boards I've been working on being as the workshop is like an Arctic outpost at present.🥶 These ones have caused a lot of headaches due to the fact that they keep failing even after long soak tests and always different faults, no doubt due to the battery vapours over time. One particularly troublesome one was working fine when first tested but then started to develop fault after fault which started to drive me demented but thankfully not enough to jump in the Thames! First thing that became apparent was it would intermittently reset and especially so when the board was slightly flexed. These type of faults can be a real headscratcher due to their intermittent nature and patience is a handy thing to have. Trying to get the fault to stay on was impossible and sometimes just a slightest touch to the board was enough to reset it. To cut a long story short by monitoring the sensor lines from all the voltage inputs I eventually found that it wasn't any of them causing it. The actual fault lie between the connection between collector of TR9 and IC3 (9). The actual voltage measured at either end varied on flexing the board, the temperature, time of day, how many glasses of wine I had (only kidding) but you get the gist. So following the track this one appears on the top side of the board just underneath where the battery was and although it looked clean there was obviously a microscopic break between the track and the via! A patch wire sorted that. Thinking a quick functional test and wrap up and on to the next one. Switch on and no boot! The reset is now stable but now what's happened? Checking around and after a few more power cycles and it starts making load white noises and other intermittent grungy sounds. No lamps were coming on and no 7 seg display so it just looked dead bar the wierd noises. All the ADD and DATA appeared to be running but nothing else was happening. A good trick is to break the meter link as this will set off an alarm if things look dead. I could tell by the sound changing to a different horrible noise that this was actually doing something and I also noted that the board would reset itself it the door switch was operated. This is when the old lightbulb went off in my head as I've had this before. IC38 (74LS32) was the culprit as pin 6 (IOWR) had no output. Switch on again and no boot, no noises, no nothing! Recheck everything again and now I see that Address line A9 is low?? This line measured 55 Ohms to ground whereas it should be in the meg Ohms. To find this every device connected to A9 has to be removed which is the CPU, all the PROMs, the RAM (which wasn't socketed but is now) and IC26 (74LS32). As soon as IC26 was removed the low resistance disappeared? I know these boards eat 74LS32's for breakfast but this is getting silly. So, switch on again and it boots but now no mux lamps or 7 seg display and none of the user switches do anything either. This is usually down to IC5 (CD4538) which monitors the updates from the CPU and switches off the mux if there's a failure. In with a new one and bingo it all works. None of these devices looked bad with no crumbly solder either so it just goes to show you can't tell anything by physical appearance. More to follow.....

Anyway, I've replaced 2 transistors: One was cracked in 2, the other was uneven to the touch. And then the 10A fuse, which was soldered into the board. Not an easy thing to find, with that form factor and rating. But..it now works. Thanks for all the help offered so far. The distance was a huge issue, but also an incentive to get the bloody thing working as well. Statto

A bit more done,soon be ready to fit electrics and wire it all up.

unless it's been altered, the original voltage for all the small hold bulbs are 6.3vac, there is a fuse for that supply on the transformer unit in the bottom of the machine, the switch that controlled the bulbs to flash is found on the hold rotary timer, the red cam or red wheel in the centre operates a switch, If the fuse and 6.3v circuit is ok then it's possible that it's just a loose wire off the rotary switch or the switch itself has failed but, As the hold lights do not light up at all then I would say the circuit from the transformer is at fault.

I'm doing a few ACE boards at present and a common issue I'm finding is failure of the transistors which drive the 'INHIBIT' lines which would stop the mech from accepting coins. If you haven't swapped them already try changing T40-46 and T31.

I know someone who may be able to help, I'll ask.

Maybe that’s where the misunderstanding come from. i wasn’t saying it isn’t great for players, or what he’s doing isn’t a good thing. I completely agree, for the niche market of older players/casuals it’s a great thing. I was simply saying surely 99% of people Who visit the bowling alley will have very limited interest in older stuff like this.. wasn’t meaning to come across negatively, was asking from a business POV is all

Think it's great that older machines pull the players,they look better and play better than modern crap.Skeggy peir used to have a section of older machines on 5p and 2p like viz and Simpson etc and I went straight to them and ignored most others. I could have a great enjoyable time for a few quid that lasted.Arcades lack good fun machines now and most new machines are not worth floor space. Think you are doing a cracking job dude.

Thanks mate.each wheel goes a different speed gettihg faster as you go up each level. And overall speed adjustable. The clutch I made from drive motor means if ball gets trapped by a wheel pin it will free itself within a few seconds.i will try and do a win vid.

I really enjoyed playing the 80s machines when I went. There was an Adams Family pinball too which was brilliant

These books are fantastic and great value

Everyone who's come over has really enjoyed playing the machine. Brought back some great memories 😀 That sounds like a great idea, being able to set up your own questions. Looking forward to seeing that when it's done. It's amazing where all the time disappears.

I’m glad you enjoy the machine and it’s a pleasure for me to keep these machines alive. Next year i will get round to writing that custom question disk software(a full windows 11 GUI app written but (like you) I am just so snowed under with other projects I’m struggling to devote any time to it. this will custom question disks to be made. i do have a prototype dos version for routine development and testing(written a couple of years ago)completed and I will upload some screenshots over the festive holiday period.

N'abandonne pas encore! You must take logical steps to find out why it's stuck in RESET. First thing to do is make sure none of the supply monitors are fowarding a voltage eg D5, D6, D10. I think we confirmed that IC2 wasn't. If however the cathode of D21 is showing high then IC1 must have pin 3 high. So if the cathodes of D5, 6 and 10 are low and the cathode of D21 is high there's something wrong with the 555 circuit. If pin 3 is low then things get a bit easier as it's just a straight forward test of 'high low, high low etc. going through all the transitors and IC's till you get to the RESET line (pin2 IC3). It's good you've swapped out all the chips (and socketed them 👍) as that will save you loads of time later. Are you confident you haven't broken any tracks or vias, I have to ask as it's easy to do if the solder has turned grey and crumbly. I don't doubt the quality of your soldering as it looks good from the pics. Bon courage.

This should be the rotary hold timer, I say should as sometimes units were converted to another use on machine rebuilds.. There should be a wired switch that a red notched cam (wheel) operates as the timer turns, it's that switch that flashes the hold lamps.

This thread is constructed to form a guide into the working actions of the 70s electro-mechanical machine. References will be made using my own Bell Fruit Super Nudge Gambler as the base machine one of the most popular electro's built in that era. To make sure that all the machines actions are fully explained will take some time,so I will post each step at intervals to allow for any comments or questions for those not sure. As the components such as relays,timers,cam switches are different from the modern machines layout,so best start with the aid of pics to show and label the main components used in the machine. All these below can fail at any time and will be the cause of many breakdowns,those and other possible faults and remedies will be explained during each part of the guide. To answer what might look as two pics the same,yes the Hold timer and Feature hold timer both look and are the same style but seperate timers, both however control different stages of the game cycle and will be explained later how & which one controls each part of the machines game. 1. Coin Switch 2. Cam Switch 3. Covered Relay 4. Open Relay 5. Cam Timer 6. Hold/Nudge/Lamp Flasher Timer 7. Feature hold/Variator Timer 8. Reel Solenoid 9. Reel motor/Drive belt 10. Payout Solenoids 11. Main Control Panel 12. Power Supply

Looks like a converted Bell Fruit Accumulator club electro. The buttons are a later addition so unless they have wired lamps to the buttons it was never designed to have light up button panel. Here is how the original machines build button panel would have looked

I know this was a LONG time ago, but did you manage to find the Cobra parts?

Hi, I run the Konix Multisystem website. You might know that the Bellfruit Viper/Cobra based games are based on the chipset developed by Flare Technology (ex Sinclair engineers) and a form of this chipset was to be used in the unreleased Konix Multisystem. There is some information known about this Bellfruit collaboration, but not a lot. I am keen to talk to anyone who has experience with these machines, or owns any part of them. Especially the Inquizitor Floppy disk(s?) or any of the games like Brain Box, Beeline, Question of Sport etc. Please get in touch and share anything you have - I'm also REALLY keen to see if I can talk to Bos Anderson of BFM or any other employees who may have information. The more information we have for the BFM implementation, the better the Konix emulation can be. Also, if you didn't know, this whole technology project was the predecessor to the Atari Jaguar - the Jaguar is effectively the Konix/Bellfruit v2. Many thanks, Mark.

Hello everyone, I have just entered this world and jumped in with my heart and purchased a machine from back in the day! It needs a bit of love as it’s a bit rough around the edges (but so am I), and I’ll probably need loads of help along the way! Thanks for letting me join, I hope I don’t ask too many stupid questions. Bigade

Ok, so that's really weird - I got a general error that I couldn't view posts and was frustratedly asking the admins for help (no response ) However... I just swithced the theme from the default and suddenly, I can access any topic and just use the forum like I'd normally expect to. Weird! Anyway - Paul has been giving me a lot of help via the messaging - so thank you Paul! And if anyone happens to have PCBs for COBRA2 or Viper / Cobra with EPROMS and Floppies then I'd love to talk with you. Cheers, Mark.

Sorry, the video are too heavy, here they are compressed. I replaced IC5 and I switched the power supply on. The led lights on and 4 seconds later ligts off... The reels turn and some bulbs light on... It's the first time that so many things happen 😄 but it's not all over. vid-20250104-163736-182_Kkx5j7f4.mp4 vid-20250104-163746-206_EydPCuco.mp4 vid-20250104-162827-276_qTojOXz9.mp4

You are totally wrong what you have said here.

Looks great,we'll done.

It is very impressive though!

What a great job from start to finish. Love seeing these kind of projects. 👍👏

Amazing 👏

Superb!!

Where is that square wave coming from? Pin 2 of the 555 will trigger if it sees the voltage drop lower than the set threshold. The aerial wire connects there too as it prevents people trying to trip the machine up using a spark generator. That would normally just be a noisy signal not a square wave? If it's 50Hz then it must be coming from one of the supply feeds?

Now all wired and tested..it works.now onto final finishing.may take a few days.

Repair job just in!

It looks very impressive Simon, a testament to your skill 👌

The other two chips are UART related, so probably for some kind of data retrieval device on the 6 pin PL15 header next to them. If you don't have anything that plugs into that connector then you most likely won't need the chips!

Thanks CanonMan, I'll check the tubes and give it a go.

Really looking forward to seeing this!

Wow, that’s really looking good. Looking forward to seeing it finished.

Great find. That’s given me more of an idea as to what it does, now.

Very cool work this @warlord Also, I was curious, so I found a picture of a (very poor condition!) original Conveyor machine, if anyone is interested to see it... Thanks for the updates, looking forward to seeing more of the recreation!

Do you know the seller Richie? few nice ones in there

A few more MPU4's just completed. This one booted but only 4 of the LED's came on, a quick blip of an alarm, a row of lamps, all the triacs bar the last one and would then freeze! Also no alpha which is par for the course. At one point whilst moving the board the alpha burst into life and the other 4 LED's lit up. I could get this to happen by flexing the board slightly. Trying to trace it by turning the board over stopped it happening, so I was back to square one. Hmm, was it a bad chip, usually something like that you'd suspect a broken track or a corroded one. No evidence was found of that so I thought I'd start with IC8 as that controls the triacs. On switch on the triacs were all on so I couldn't tell if it was doing the triac test or not? Before removing IC8 the 4049 chip below it looked really badly corroded so I thought I'd get that removed first in case there were any corroded tracks underneath. The solder had gone to that grey crumbly stuff and no matter how much flux and resoldering it wouldn't come out. The only way is to cut all the legs off and remove each one separately. All was good underneath so a new one was fitted. Luckily the 68B21 (IC8) came out a bit easier and with a new one fitted I was greeted with the triac test working, all the LEDs and the alpha. Everything now appeared to be OK except the last triac. This was due to a short circuit zener diode. The next one needed a new RAM chip before it would boot, the alpha wasn't running either. Not due to corrosion this time but a short circuit zener on the reset pin. On boot up it was alarming but until I had the alpha going I had no idea why. Anyway with it now functioning I was greeted with IRQ SLOW ALARM! Blimey what causes that? I had a light bulb moment and remembered something from another tech that said this is controlled from the 6840 and with a new one fitted it passed all the tests. Last one for now.... This one tried to boot but there was no alpha, no sound, no LED display or triac test. To save on all the grisly details IC1 (6840 again) and IC8 (68B21 again) had both failed.

The Variator cam and (Jackpot control cam.fitted only to club electro's) The Variator is a timer controlled cam which basically stops the reels from running in a sequence. Variator or scrambler described on some schematics cam is made in raised steps of unequal size, It these steps that the cam switch rolls over and in turn causes the switch to make and break a circuit. This circuit is connected to the main game control timer. The main game control timer has a 3 second revolution so without the variator it would normally take it 3 seconds to complete it's 360 degree in every game cycle. Once the start button is pressed and the main control timer sets off on it's cycle and the game begins,Just before the reel solenoids lift to let the reels spin the switch running on the variator cam takes control of the circuit to the main control tmer motor. Because of the make and break action or the variator cam switch, the circuit to the control timer motor is now switched with an on/off action as the variator cam turns. It's during the reel spin and while the variator has control of the circuit that the control timer motor cycle is increased anywhere between 3&5 seconds. It is this difference in the rotation time of the main control timer that in turn makes the difference in the release point of the reel solenoids.This is measured in m/sec but enough to stop the reels running in sequence. The variator returns control of the main control timer to finish it's cycle once all three reels have stopped......... The Jackpot control cam is designed to reduce the chances of gaining any of the higher jackpot wins.At best it could be called a % control.I always thought it was an illegal device. Having said that,It was a known feature the Gaming Board were aware of at the time. Again much like the variator cam,It has a similar stepped cam.The difference was that the jackpot control cam was wired to a set of studs on reel board 2. The reel drum wipers on reel 2 passing over the wired studs would complete a circuit actually wired to the number 2 reel solenoid. The jackpot control circuit wired to the studs would correspond exactly in the same position as the highest jackpot symbols position on the reel drum. The switch on the jackpot control timer would operate with the similar make or break circuit to the wired studs. If the circuit from the jackpot control switch is active when the jackpot symbol drops onto the win line,The active circuit prevents the reel 2 solenoid from dropping until the symbol has gone past the win line,The wipers have now passed by the wired studs breaking the circuit and allowing the solenoid to drop. Players can notice this action when the second reel appears to skip. Because the electro club was normally a four reel machine,the control circuit on reel two would prevent wins from left to right,right to left and all four reels where the top jackpot symbols were concerned. To assist this action you would always find only one jackpot symbol on reel two.

Pics as requested! It's a nice simple unit, not a lot to go wrong.